Just thought I'd share this with you. At the end of last year I began updating all our MSDS which were years out of date using Chemwatch..
Having not completed them I'm doing this now. I have accidently printed one for Stannous chloride (dihydrate) that I'd printed last december. The issue date on this was April 2005.
The issue date on the one I've just printed is Jan 2008. The Hazard alert on the chemical has gone from Moderate to Extreme!!! with various changes in Risk and Safety statements!!
THis leads to the question of how many others will have changed??!!
Aren't the MSDS valid up to 5 years after the issue date??
Chemwatch can change MSDS when they see fit too. As each chemcial is checked via your Large MSDS book. We need to check the issue date, if it has changed since you last printed your one, then a new one needs to be printed. They are not vauled for 5 years, it is up to chemwatch when you issue a new one. Its our job to check once a year on the issue date.
Some years we can get lots of changes, even class changes say from class N/C nonclassified to a class 9. And other years very little changes.
Regards Labbie
Lab Manager/Lab Tech, mind reading etc etc
Now retired
Yes Sue I understand that they can change at any time but it is ONLY 3 months since I printed it. IF I was doing an annual check it would be in November when I do the stocktake of chemicals. I understood that for US the MSDS were valid for 5 years form the date of issue and I have looked at previous posts on this issue and that seems to be the concensus!!
The point I was trying to make that was obviously lost was the fact we could have a Possible OH&S issue if we had an accident with this chemical and was using a MSDS that we assumed was current because it was only 3 months since I printed it!!
Yes I agree with Rae.
Surely they could not hold us responsible. We have no time to sit and check every MSDS. I go through my hard copies once a year and any that are VERY close to expiry date, I will reprint. As it is, I am the only one remotely interested in MSDS. Teachers just grunt and expect it to be ready. I know they are very busy,too
I check my MSDS sheets every couple of years - however, not a single teacher has ever used one in a classroom, never asked to see one, and I even laminated the most commonly used (HCl, NaOH, H2SO4) etc., and used to place them in with the orders - they were thrown back on the bench in the Prep room. I would say that less than 5 students in our school would ever have seen an MSDS! I have them printed out, all in a brightly coloured folder beside my desk. However, as stated - staff here NEVER use them.
That is their whole purpose. I'm told they need to accompany every prac when in reality they need to be readily accessed in an emergency. Now whether you keep them alphabetically in a ready to reach file, on the prac trolley in the lab with the class or beside where they sit on a shelf is up to you and what you find workable. We have a risk assessment on the rear of the request sheet and the MSDS sit on the shelf beside the chemical it's for. Works for us but maybe not for others.
Updating your MSDS is what you can undertake as often as humanly practical. The CSIS package is the same for those that write it here in NSW, they are doing it bit by bit and when information comes to hand. There are flaws in it and when and how it's updated but it's the tool we've been given to work with so be it. No one will have a perfect MSDS system in place because of it. No use banging your head against the wall trying to do otherwise just keep on top of what you have.
Richard Hollinworth Disease diagnosis and extension services
DPI&F
Biosecurity Sciences Laboratory
Yes I agree, No one ever lookes at ours MSDS, only me once a year when I check the Issue dates. I have never seen any one look at them. But we did have a audit come and ask were they were located. We then had to put a sign up MSDS located here on the wall. Its a thankless job. One a hate, but its the law, or so I am told.
Last year or was it 2006, copper sulfate came up as class 6, we were not told of this change, so changed all the copper sulfate to sit in class 6, I mentioned this at a net work meeting, we brought it up then and their on the computer, and it was back to class 9. I had got the MSDS to show I had not gone mad. Head Teacher "Said if you have the MSDS down as class 6, leave it" Until you check the MSDS next year. So that is what we did. Silly????????????
Regards Labbie
Lab Manager/Lab Tech, mind reading etc etc
Now retired
If I gave the teachers a folder to look at, I am sure it would never be opened... Instead I print on the back of the order form a little mini msds, stating hazards, disposal and some first aid advice. And the teachers have to read it out loud before any practical commences, and they all do this its really quite simple to do this, it requires a bit of work to start with, but basically what I did, was copy from chemgold and pasted into a word doc whenever a chemical was requested... Now I have them all ready in a word doc, and when teachers request a chemical, I simply look it up, copy and paste into new word doc and print on the back of the order form, and most of the time I actually check chemgold first as well to see that nothing has changed, all in all it takes me about 5 min to do it. I do however have proper MSDS printed out in folders in each of my three prep rooms for a back up.
We use the mini-MSDS' off Chemwatch too, one accompanies each chemical into every classroom and teachers use them for their safety pre-lab and for quick reference. We still have the full MSDS' of course but like everyone else, they are seldom looked at by teachers.
At the moment our chemical register (also required by law for all hazardous substances and soon dangerous goods when the new regs come in combining haz substances and dangerous goods soon) is on a program on the school server however if you subscribe to chemwatch you can do this on their system which then means any time a change is made to an MSDS you use (ie. is in your register) then they will notify you of the change and fax the new MSDS to you. So if you are concerned about missing something that is always an option. But you need to remember that it may not be a good idea to only have your MSDS' electronically on Chemwatch as if there is a fire and power is lost then they will not "be easily accessible in case of emergency" to the firefighters or whoever.
Also a bit of a side point, we just have an additional column in our chemical register with MSDS expiry date, I do a quick search of the database each month for any expiring the following and that's it.
Should be everything you keep. Hazardous or not. Even cleaning goods, metho, windex, Mr sheen etc technically should have one - throughout the school not just Science. At least what's in your chem store for practicality.
Richard Hollinworth Disease diagnosis and extension services
DPI&F
Biosecurity Sciences Laboratory
rae wrote:How many chemicals do people have that they are printing MSDS for??
I have my Mini MSDS's in a couple of folders next to my desk. Just counted 232 Mini MSDS"S. Most have expired last year, and I am in the process of reprinting them (all in pretty "Technicolour" , and laminated, as they are requested. My aim is to include them in the tray with each prac. Our new Chem teacher is pretty good in going through them with her classes, but most of the other teachers are not interested.
I have not even looked at the 4 stuffed Arch Lever files of FULL MSDS's. I will tackle that when I wave the Mini's right.
Gday All,
The usual wording in legislation is along these lines, "5 years or when a change is made, new information is available"
So the way I read it is you have to check every time you use a chemical.
On my experiment setup sheet I list all chemicals which makes it easier to do a quick scan to see MSDS issue dates since last use.
Hope this helps.
CYA.....IRD
I agree, everything should be on the register. I may have gone too far with the toothepaste but hey, why not, lol. Do different states or government schools have very different requirements for this sort of thing (have only ever worked in Tassy in a private one)? As although we do have a register with every single thing in it, hazardous or not (and I believe this is an extremely good thing to do), I was told by the good people at IPM (Injury Prevention and management) training and also Workplace Safe Tasmania that it was not required by law. I guess it makes no difference to me as i do it anyway but i don't want to give other people the wrong advice.
Hi All,
Can anyone tell me how much Chemwatch costs? Do your schools have a bulk subscription??
At the moment most schools in WA don't use Chemwatch. I have heard that it is very expensive, but I could be wrong.
However with the enormity of what we need to do to comply with regulations regarding hazardous chemicals, chemical register, the updated MSDSs, labelling that complies with all the risk and safety phrases, knowing the cutoffs for fixing hazardous diamonds as well as the changes in the risk and safety phrases as the solutions become more and more dilute, risk assessments etc......I am wondering that it might be worth the money???
I know that there have been queries about accessing online, but it sounds as though most of you are generally happy with the product. Am I correct?
Also it is interesting to see that we all have the same issues regardless of which state or territory we are in.
its really quite simple to do this, it requires a bit of work to start with, but basically what I did, was copy from chemgold and pasted into a word doc whenever a chemical was requested... Now I have them all ready in a word doc, and when teachers request a chemical, I simply look it up, copy and paste into new word doc and print on the back of the order form, and most of the time I actually check chemgold first as well to see that nothing has changed, all in all it takes me about 5 min to do it. I do however have proper MSDS printed out in folders in each of my three prep rooms for a back up.
